Does marathon RUN training help or hurt marathon SWIM training

jheynesjheynes Member
edited July 2015 in General Discussion

Question: What are the Opinions on Marathon RUN training correlating to the success in a Marathon Swimming event? Do you think it hurts, helps, or has no affect, on success of a Marathon swim over 20 miles?

Can Marathon Run training days replace Marathon Swim training days. ie Swim Mon-Wed-Fr, long runs on T-Thur

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Comments

  • SydneDSydneD Senior Member

    I've been running less these days, and my swimming is improving. I'm feeling faster and less worn out than when I have been running my typical schedule of 30+ miles per week.

  • IronMikeIronMike Moscow, RussiaCharter Member
    edited July 2015

    I've never trained for a marathon (running), but I can say that my swim fitness does not seem to translate to run fitness. Seems there are two different "lungs." I can swim for hours, but can run for about 10 minutes before I'm huffing and puffing!

  • klassmanklassman VirginiaMember

    This question has been discussed at length in the triathlon community. Both the conventional wisdom and the evidence from the few studies out there suggest some correlation but not a strong effect. If you start with a base level of aerobic fitness, then more swimming will marginally help the "latter half" of endurance running performance (think of it as the last six miles of a marathon.) However, with a base level of aerobic fitness, more running will not show much, if at all, positive effects on your endurance swimming.

    The theory is that more swimming continues the progression of aerobic base, mitochondria development etc. and additionally it will help develop your core muscles which aid everything from breathing well to your posture while running. However, more running doesn't translate much because it takes longer for the body to recover (than swimming) and the principal muscle groups that are improved are your legs which matter to endurance swimming but not as much as strong and steady core muscles do to swimming.

    tortugabluemermaid9evmo
  • timsroottimsroot Spring, TXCharter Member

    IronMike I've never trained for a marathon (running), but I can say that my swim fitness does not seem to translate to run fitness. Seems there are two different "lungs." I can swim for hours, but can run for about 10 minutes before I'm huffing and puffing!

    Not that I've tried to run often, but I'm guessing that, at least for me, this is correlated to the difference in heart rates. When I swim, my heart rate probably hangs out in the 150s or 160s. When I run, we open the bidding for heart rate at the upper 170s once I get warmed up, more likely the mid 180s. It's been quite some time since I would have considered myself in good shape for running, so I don't know if my heart rate gets slower while I'm running but in better shape.

  • danswimsdanswims Portland, ORMember

    My swim coach is of the opinion that running has a negative impact on ankle flexibility which then leads to increased drag in the kick.

    tortuga
  • malinakamalinaka Seattle, WACharter Member

    I believe the MIMS record holder also runs a sub-3 marathon...

    tortugaSuirThingJaimie

    I don't wear a wetsuit; it gives the ocean a sporting chance.

  • bluemermaid9bluemermaid9 Boca Raton, FL, United StatesMember

    I trained for GCBS 4.4 this year and now I'm training for MCM. I think all that swimming is having a positive impact in my running due to a stronger core. As for the opposite... my legs are toast the Mondays after the long run. Luckily we have 'mellow Mondays' at Masters. ;) All joking aside, I have noticed that if my running mileage is high, I can go a little harder in an open water race.

  • wendyv34wendyv34 Vashon, WASenior Member

    I think it really depends on the individual. Some swimmers can run without issues, others can't. I have flat feet (suction cups, really) and flexible ankles. As a result, my running mechanics are horrible, so my years of triathlon were painful and frustrating. I couldn't believe how great I felt once I finally quit running!

    After that, I gave bike racing 5 years and I was in amazing shape during that time. I barely swam (less than 10k/wk.) but I was as fast as I am now, (currently 20-25K/wk. when not in racing season) especially at "shorter" distances (500m-1K). After I stopped racing, I bike-commuted for a number of years, (150 mi/wk.) with similar results. After getting clobbered by a car, I only bike commute seasonally at a much lower volume, but I still notice that my endurance is better and my kick is stronger during the sunny months when I'm biking.

    Bottom line, I think running or cycling will benefit your long swims, whichever one you enjoy and can tolerate.

    It's always a bad hair day when you work at a pool.

  • timsroottimsroot Spring, TXCharter Member

    danswims My swim coach is of the opinion that running has a negative impact on ankle flexibility which then leads to increased drag in the kick.

    I had a personal trainer friend tell me something similar. Running favors ankle flexion, swimming favors ankle extension. For me, and I suspect a lot of people, unless you do a lot of both, they will work against each other.

    I'd love to run an ultra some day, but with all I have going on, I can only have one obsessive hobby at a time, and right now, I choose swimming.

    kipariz
  • andissandiss Senior Member

    I think there is benefits other then just the physical performance.

    For example it's a easier way to test different types of feeds and how your stomach react and etc.

    tortuga
  • bruckbruck San FranciscoMember

    I also wonder if the highly-developed leg musculature from running would cause a swimmer's legs and lower body to be "sinkier" in the water, increasing drag.

  • morecircusmorecircus San FranciscoGuest

    Breathing. I think swimmers long distance tend to breath more from their stomache area, versus runners tend to breath more from their upper chest. Just look at bodies of swimmers, to bodies of runners & cyclists. The famous Lynn Cox's new craft is Opra Singing. Singing uses lots of lower stomach musles & lower breathing. Anotherwards running & cycling help for swim sprinting because they are all breathing in upper chest. Meditation taught me to breath from my lower stomache area also. I would recommend to a runner to take meditation & singing lessons to boost up their swimming.

  • andissandiss Senior Member

    Wouldnt boxing be a better training aid for swimming?!

    tortuga
  • andissandiss Senior Member

    Than running I mean

  • tortugatortuga Senior Member

    andiss said: Wouldnt boxing be a better training aid for swimming?!

    I would think so. Heavy bag works the core like nothing else

    andiss
  • andissandiss Senior Member

    I read an interview with Anna Karin Nordin from 2010 where she said she does boxning and weights plus her 38.000m week.

    Seem to make perfect sense - plenty of training for muscles in the whole shoulder area.

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